Author Topic: PIP All 1.6 million claims to be reviewed  (Read 828 times)

KizzyKazaer

  • Administrator
  • Super Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8243
Re: PIP All 1.6 million claims to be reviewed
« Reply #15 on: January 31, 2018, 09:25:24 PM »
Also - Monic, thanks for shedding some light on the PIP reviews in your reply #9.  I was wondering if there were others here on OuchToo denied the mobility component under the original rules because they 'only' had 'psychological distress...'

Monic1511

  • Moderator Welfare Rights
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2179
Re: PIP All 1.6 million claims to be reviewed
« Reply #16 on: January 31, 2018, 09:44:31 PM »
Re an appeal, this is done on an SSCS1 form and the text area for ďreasons for appealĒ is less than half a page.  The reason for this is because you normally give full reasons at the actual appeal.
I normally write you have failed to consider the severity frequency and full effect of my problems. I do not ( pick the most obvious reason ).   The tribunal service will accept the appeal.  The you get a full copy of the papers.   Itís at this stage I write a submission explaining each criteria and why my person meets that criteria.

As a representative I dislike long 3 or 4 page appeal letters. They tend to be so detailed that they leave me no wiggle room and the panel want to know why I ask for different criteria from my clients.

Claimant has written I sometimes make a meal but I donít eat it. They have asked for points for needing supervision to prepare a meal and what they really mean is that if forced to they will help a partner make a meal but if the partner isnít there they will make a simple meal but donít do it often.
I then go to the panel and have to argue that they only cook very infrequently and by cooking they mean reheat a microwave meal.

Sunny you can take medical evidence with you on the day of the appeal,  the panel normally accept it but if you have a visually impaired panel member you will need to read the evidence to them.  This is one of the reasons the panel asks for the evidence beforehand- itís to convert it to Braille.

Since the dwp wonít change their decision at this late stage my advice would be keep the appeal letter to the very basic. The dwp has made several factual errors and also ignored that I have aids for hearing. I donít believe they have considered the full effect of my difficulties and the impact on my daily life.

😉

Sunny Clouds

  • Charter Member
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4577
Re: PIP All 1.6 million claims to be reviewed
« Reply #17 on: January 31, 2018, 10:41:42 PM »
The guidance notes specifically state that you should say which points you are appealing, so that is what I shall do.

But I shall refer to the armed forces thing.  It's my main reason for appealing.

Quote
Your reasons do not have to be lengthy or written in legal language, but you need to say more than just, ĎI disagreeĎ. You should explain simply why you think the decision you are appealing against is incorrect. It might be useful for you to state what you consider the correct decision should be.
The more specific you are about the points of dispute, the easier it is for the tribunal to understand what your grievance is and to focus their attention on this before the hearing. For example, in an appeal regarding Universal Credit, it is helpful to write down which elements of the Universal Credit award you disagree with. These are the composite parts
of the Universal Credit award which are intended to reflect your householdís needs. You are welcome to attach evidence which you feel may be supportive to your appeal, but you should not delay appealing while you obtain this.
If you need more space to write your reasons you can attach a separate sheet of paper.

I do not see the point of submitting it without stating which points I am or am not appealing.  If I were appealing all of it, it would be different.

I am not saying that I want to send all the information now.  As I've already said earlier today, I'm aware that I can submit more evidence later.

To you, maybe what takes time is long things.  To me, what takes time is making things short.


 
(I'm an obsessive problem-solver, so feel free to ignore any suggestions or solutions I offer, even if they sound terribly insistent.)

Monic1511

  • Moderator Welfare Rights
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2179
Re: PIP All 1.6 million claims to be reviewed
« Reply #18 on: January 31, 2018, 10:47:20 PM »
Itís your appeal so you do what is best for you.
The reason reps donít give definite points at this stage is that you are showing all your info to the dwp and the dwp presenting officer then turns up with counter arguments prepared. If I present it on the day the presenting officer is scrambling about for a counter argument that isnít calling my client a liar.
 >dove<

Sunny Clouds

  • Charter Member
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4577
Re: PIP All 1.6 million claims to be reviewed
« Reply #19 on: January 31, 2018, 10:57:11 PM »
That makes sense.

So say which points I'm challenging, but give more detail after I've got the 'defence' papers?

That makes sense.
(I'm an obsessive problem-solver, so feel free to ignore any suggestions or solutions I offer, even if they sound terribly insistent.)

Sunny Clouds

  • Charter Member
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4577
Re: PIP All 1.6 million claims to be reviewed
« Reply #20 on: January 31, 2018, 11:11:13 PM »
Ok, I'll whittle it right down to the bare minimum and see what the adviser thinks on Friday as to whether I've said enough without playing my cards.

Buggrit, this goes against all my inclinations, my obsessive-compulsive explaining, explaining, explaining, but I shall be a good girl, honest!
(I'm an obsessive problem-solver, so feel free to ignore any suggestions or solutions I offer, even if they sound terribly insistent.)

auntieCtheM

  • Charter Member
  • Super Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 5583
Re: PIP All 1.6 million claims to be reviewed
« Reply #21 on: February 01, 2018, 12:56:37 AM »
Sunny, just take a step backwards for a mo.  Why are you getting so wound up?  Think about it.  You are doing this on principle, not because you will not be able to pay the bills if you do not get more PIP.  So try to calm down and think of all this as an academic exercise, not a personal one.  Try not to develop an ulcer over it.   >hugs<

lankou

  • Charter Member
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2762
Re: PIP All 1.6 million claims to be reviewed
« Reply #22 on: February 01, 2018, 06:49:02 PM »
Some clarification from the Disability News Service:-

More at link:-

https://www.disabilitynewsservice.com/dwp-promises-no-one-will-lose-out-in-huge-review-of-1-6-million-pip-cases/


DWP promises no-one will lose out in huge review of 1.6 million PIP cases

By John Pring  on  February 1, 2018

The Department for Work and Pensions (DWP) has promised that no disabled people will have their benefits reduced because of its decision to review 1.6 million personal independence payment (PIP) claims.



Sunny Clouds

  • Charter Member
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4577
Re: PIP All 1.6 million claims to be reviewed
« Reply #23 on: February 01, 2018, 07:22:49 PM »
"Why are you getting so wound up?  "

Because for all that there might be an issue of money, and for all that I feel I should pursue it, the thing I'm having a problem with (and would have whether I pursued it or not) is about whether I'm believed.

As is cropping up in other threads, the whole issue of being believed or not, whether on a personal level or as part of the current scrounger rhetoric, is painful for many.

I started writing my PIP application whilst approving my father's 2018 Who's Who entry.  Every time I walked into his room, whichever nurse or HCA that was sitting with him went off on one about how much he'd achieved, based on his 'memory book'.  After he died, I've had how wonderful he was rammed down my throat.  A seemingly endless reminder of how wonderful he was and how wonderful I'm not.

But if I've got to face the issues relating to what I didn't achieve, then I want people to know I didn't simply wake up one day and think "I know what, I'll pretend I'm not very well."

I admit that this is influencing decisions I hadn't thought it would.  I'd always thought in terms of society more readily accepting the reality of physical impairments than mental impairments, but it depends what they are.  How could I ever explain to the DWP that the main reason I'm often too distressed, no, too scared, to go out of the house is the way people treat me when I fall over?  That typically I fall over every second or third time I leave the house?  And I feel horribly depressed and probably closer than I'd like to the edge between justifiable anxiety and paranoia, and my obsessive-compulsiveness is only just under control.  But if I increase my meds to compensate for that, to try to control it, symptoms will increase that the system thinks don't matter a jot.  Hey, who cares whether I break bones falling over in the house?  Who cares that I had 3 mild TBIs last year that have left me with ongoing neck pain, sleep problems etc?  Who cares that I fall over on approximately every fourth bus journey?  Not long before Christmas, I had a day when I caught four buses.  I fell over on three of them.

I hate, hate, hate this whole system.  I hate the way in which it's all carved up into mental and physical.  I now have an anger, a bitterness, a resentment, a hatred towards my local mental health trust and a particular team.  I rarely hate people, but I'm close to hating one psychiatrist in particular.  I wake in the night wishing I'd sued the lot of them for turning me from someone struggling to cope with a whole series of bad things happening to them, to someone who'd been gaslight into feeling totally, utterly worthless.  I don't say I felt very confident before, but it was hard-won confidence. 

Logically, rationally, reasonably I need to disconnect this appeal from all that.  However, for me, this is about vindication.  It's like a trial.  It's about saying "I am who I am and I'm what I am.  I'm genuine.  I have needs and I fight bloody hard to deal with them.  Do me the honour of not denying them."

I'd be feeling rather differently if they'd put up a good argument, but they didn't.  It's not "You haven't proven your entitlement to PIP to a reasonable standard." it's "We've decided you shouldn't get it so we'll simply tell you that what you're saying isn't true."

(I'm an obsessive problem-solver, so feel free to ignore any suggestions or solutions I offer, even if they sound terribly insistent.)

Monic1511

  • Moderator Welfare Rights
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2179
Re: PIP All 1.6 million claims to be reviewed
« Reply #24 on: February 01, 2018, 08:46:36 PM »
 >bighugs<


SteveX

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1311
Re: PIP All 1.6 million claims to be reviewed
« Reply #25 on: February 01, 2018, 09:06:31 PM »
>bighugs<
Member of POMMAS

KizzyKazaer

  • Administrator
  • Super Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8243
Re: PIP All 1.6 million claims to be reviewed
« Reply #26 on: February 01, 2018, 09:20:50 PM »
Quote
Logically, rationally, reasonably I need to disconnect this appeal from all that.  However, for me, this is about vindication.  It's like a trial.  It's about saying "I am who I am and I'm what I am.  I'm genuine.  I have needs and I fight bloody hard to deal with them.  Do me the honour of not denying them."

Sunny - the whole process of claiming PIP (and DLA, for that matter) brought up for me just about every incident of abuse I've survived since 1979, so what you are feeling is completely understandable and natural.  These benefit awards represent being taken seriously, being accepted as genuinely ill, etc etc, so no wonder such emotional capital gets invested in them.  Try and stay connected to that logical-rational side if you can, while allowing another side of you to rage justifiably against all the mistreatment.   And remember we care.

Sunny Clouds

  • Charter Member
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4577
Re: PIP All 1.6 million claims to be reviewed
« Reply #27 on: February 01, 2018, 09:26:49 PM »
Just knowing that others here understand is half the battle.
(I'm an obsessive problem-solver, so feel free to ignore any suggestions or solutions I offer, even if they sound terribly insistent.)

KizzyKazaer

  • Administrator
  • Super Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8243
Re: PIP All 1.6 million claims to be reviewed
« Reply #28 on: February 01, 2018, 09:29:28 PM »
We're not going anywhere...

Just an addition that your post made me think of:  you mentioned 'gaslighting', which is a form of emotional abuse.  For any interested reader, here's some information about it:

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/toxic-relationships/201801/how-know-if-youre-victim-gaslighting

I've put this up because once a silly little turd of a 'man' I met on the Internet tried it on me.  Nuff said  :-)

(oops, off-topic.  Should I moderate myself?)  ;-) >devil<

>edited to add....
« Last Edit: February 01, 2018, 09:31:36 PM by KizzyKazaer »

KizzyKazaer

  • Administrator
  • Super Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8243
Re: PIP All 1.6 million claims to be reviewed
« Reply #29 on: February 01, 2018, 10:29:51 PM »
...getting serious again (and do excuse my attempt at BBC Ouch-inspired humour!  Those who were part of that board will remember about 'off-topic' and all that).  Even to read and then actually post that above link was slightly triggering, so that goes to show how powerful the effects of 'gaslighting' are for a long time afterwards.  What complicated it, I found, was trying to explain to others (especially those who were in a position to help but didn't) how I was systematically being 'played'.  That is, when I finally realised something was terribly wrong... How many others has this happened to, I've often wondered, and that's why the dissemination of relevant information is so important.   

What has this to do with PIP?  Well, if having your mind turned inside out - and being left with permanent 'head demons' as a result - then leaves you less able to function in your daily activities and your getting around ....

Beg pardon if I've gone on a bit  >blush<