Author Topic: Who or what has got at Iain Duncan Smith?  (Read 680 times)

lankou

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Who or what has got at Iain Duncan Smith?
« on: June 30, 2017, 08:46:56 AM »
https://inews.co.uk/essentials/news/politics/iain-duncan-smith-admits-work-capability-assessments-harsh/

Iain Duncan Smith says work capability assessments don’t work and are ‘too harsh’


Sunny Clouds

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Re: Who or what has got at Iain Duncan Smith?
« Reply #1 on: June 30, 2017, 01:30:44 PM »
He's just wrapping up the next bit of nastiness in a veneer of trying to make things kinder.

Think about it.

Once upon a time, it was relatively simple.  You either were or weren't considered fit enough for word to  be expected currently to do it or to go looking for it or to train for it.  It was, I believe, in the days of incapacity benefit, relatively easy to do what work you could, when you could.  There was an acceptance that some people, the sort that once would have been hidden away in hospitals, would only be able to do work as a sort of therapy or as a sort of doing what they could.

Then we get ESA.  You're either thought to be, approximately permanently fit for work or fit at some future date.  The emphasis being on how it's not fair on people who'll never be fit for work to assume they will be, as a cover for imposing conditions on those who it's thought might be in future.  There's also the subtle drift to 'limited' capacity for work.  Suddenly your sick note doesn't mean you can't work, it means you can't do much work, even if actually you can't do any.

Then we get the sick note becoming a fit note.  Again, that drift away from not expected to to expected to, disguised as a drift from what you can't do to what you can do.

Then we get the imposition of hideous sanctions on people for not participating in work-related activity mandated by people who know expletive-all about what people can or cannot be realistically expected to to.  Again, this drift in ideas used as a cover for punishing people for what isn't their fault and portraying them as lazy scroungers.

Then we get the stuff now about bringing in some sort of obligations on people in the support group to engage in some activities, again mandated by people with no relevant qualifications, together with sanctions coming in if they don't, another excuse to sanction.

And now this?  No, it's not about making it less harsh, it's about continuing that drift, about saying there's no such thing as unfit for work, which, in other words, means there's no such thing as not being expected to do some work or look for some work or engage in activities supposedly preparatory to work. 

The giveaway is the classic misuse of statistics, and a very unoriginal one that we've all seen over and over again by New Labour, Coalition and Tory.  "If you’re in work you’re likely to be healthier."

It's about portraying correlation as causation or even reversing causation.  Let us for the sake of  argument say that people that are in work are likely to be healthier than people that are not.  He is using this fact as authority for the proposition that being in work causes people to be healthier.

However, I would argue that the reason that people in work are healthier than people that are not in work is that people that are less healthy are variously incapable of work, not seeking work, or not in practical terms employable, in other words that being less healthy  people not to be in work, or, switching it to positives, that being more healthy causes people to be in work.

So this isn't niceness, it's just more propaganda, more distorted statistics, another step towards removing essential help both to divert money from those in need to the exremely wealthy, and to scare people into working if they're even half way towards well enough to work, working in insecure jobs in poor conditions where their disability or sickness is an excuse for employers to exploit their vulnerability and dump them when they've outlived their usefulness.

This is nothing to do with making the test less harsh and everything to do with being more cruel, causing more suffering, destitution, death.




lankou

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Re: Who or what has got at Iain Duncan Smith?
« Reply #2 on: June 30, 2017, 02:07:31 PM »
He's just wrapping up the next bit of nastiness in a veneer of trying to make things kinder.

to do with making the test less harsh and everything to do with being more cruel, causing more suffering, destitution, death.

The problem with that is, is he is not a cabinet minister and not likely to be.

Sunny Clouds

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Re: Who or what has got at Iain Duncan Smith?
« Reply #3 on: June 30, 2017, 04:08:15 PM »
He doesn't need to be, he just needs to support the party line in order to suck up to the people that may affect his future.

Cynical?  Moi?  Surely not!

gorbut

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Re: Who or what has got at Iain Duncan Smith?
« Reply #4 on: July 01, 2017, 04:06:23 PM »
Maybe he is worried by the fact his majority has dropped to around 2 and a half thousand in a seat that has been a safe conservative one for as long as I can remember and is trying to fool us into thinking he cares about people.

lankou

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Re: Who or what has got at Iain Duncan Smith?
« Reply #5 on: July 01, 2017, 04:48:17 PM »
Maybe he is worried by the fact his majority has dropped to around 2 and a half thousand in a seat that has been a safe conservative one for as long as I can remember and is trying to fool us into thinking he cares about people.

That thought had crossed my mind. Apparently the quiet man was a very worried man during the count.

Sunny Clouds

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Re: Who or what has got at Iain Duncan Smith?
« Reply #6 on: July 01, 2017, 05:34:53 PM »
The thought of IDS feeling worried has improved my mood no end.  Now all we need is for someone to find something wrong with his paperwork/finances/personal life and turf him out of parliament.

Sadly, whilst I believe he's more than capable of being corrupt, I think he's more likely to be incompetent, so if he gets caught with anything amiss, he'll wriggle out of it in a way claimants with genuine reasons for not doing something or saying something don't wriggle out of sanctions.


NeuralgicNeurotic

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Re: Who or what has got at Iain Duncan Smith?
« Reply #7 on: July 02, 2017, 02:24:14 PM »
https://inews.co.uk/essentials/news/politics/iain-duncan-smith-admits-work-capability-assessments-harsh/

Iain Duncan Smith says work capability assessments don’t work and are ‘too harsh’




The interview might have something to do with this:


https://www.disabilitynewsservice.com/queens-speech-government-appears-to-dump-mordaunts-wca-election-promise/


Quote
Queen’s speech: Government appears to dump Mordaunt’s WCA election promise


A Tory election promise to “dismantle” the work capability assessment (WCA) through new legislation appears to have been abandoned, with the Queen’s speech containing no mention of any new social security bill.

The speech contains brief details of all planned legislation over the next two years – rather than the usual 12 months – so the absence of a social security bill suggests work and pensions ministers have abandoned planned reforms to the much-criticised “fitness for work” test.

The minister for disabled people, Penny Mordaunt, told a national disability hustings event a few days before the general election that a Conservative government would “legislate to reform the work capability assessment”, which “treats people like they are part of a sausage factory”.

Mordaunt (pictured, right, at the hustings) then added: “We have managed to get into the manifesto a legislative commitment to dismantle the work capability assessment.”




Quote
Both Labour and the Liberal Democrats promised in their general election manifestos to scrap the WCA.

Disability News Service (DNS) tried repeatedly after Mordaunt’s comments to confirm what she meant by the promise to “dismantle” the WCA, as there was no mention of scrapping the assessment in her party’s manifesto.

The manifesto did promise that a Conservative government would “legislate to give unemployed disabled claimants or those with a health condition personalised and tailored employment support”.

When contacted about the failure to include a social security bill in the Queen’s speech, a Department for Work and Pensions spokesman said: “We have been told not to say anything at the moment.”

He directed DNS to the Number 10 press office, which had not commented by noon today (Thursday).

Ministers are expected to respond in the next few months to the consultation on its controversial work, health and disability green paper, which was published last October.

It is not yet clear how the absence of new legislation will affect proposals laid out in the green paper, which include a suggestion that all people on out-of-work disability benefits – even those who are terminally-ill or have the very highest support needs – could in future have to stay in regular touch with their local jobcentre or risk having their benefits sanctioned.


To be honest, I'm happy enough to see anything linked to the Work and Health greeen paper, and its creepy promotion of work as a 'cure' for illness, shelved.  What's disturbing about the article linked to in the OP is this paragraph:

Quote
He added that this “cliff edge” view of work and illness adds stress to the process and encourages people to misrepresent their conditions to assessors.

Once again, this frames the story in terms of ESA climants being dishonest, and promotes the idea that it's somehow impossible for so many people to be sick or disabled enough to qualify for the benefit, and especially the support group. We must be lying.  >angry<

ATurtle

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Re: Who or what has got at Iain Duncan Smith?
« Reply #8 on: July 02, 2017, 04:40:38 PM »
Let's hope that some enterprising back-bencher gets an opposition bill into the house and the DUP grow a backbone and stand up for what is right i.e. the abolition of the WCA.  (Is it telling that my tablet suggested IRA after "abolition of the")
Tony.

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NeuralgicNeurotic

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Re: Who or what has got at Iain Duncan Smith?
« Reply #9 on: July 02, 2017, 06:23:28 PM »
Let's hope that some enterprising back-bencher gets an opposition bill into the house and the DUP grow a backbone and stand up for what is right i.e. the abolition of the WCA.  (Is it telling that my tablet suggested IRA after "abolition of the")

Well, if you leave aside Sammy Wilson (East Antrim) and Gregory Campbell (East Londonderry) who are both ecomonic right-wingers, there's a core Westminster group consisting of Nigel Dodds and Gavin Robinson (Belfast and North and East respectively), Jeffrey Donaldson (Lagan Valley), Jim Shannon (Strangford) and David Simpson (Upper Bann), who have consistently voted against cuts to disability and incapacity benefits. Jim Shannon in particular has sponsored a number of the private members bills relating to this issue. Ian Paisley Jr (North Antrim) has also sometimes voted against benefit cuts. Emma Pengelly won her seat in Belfast South by appealing to working class loyalists, so may be inclined to vote against such measures also.

Of course, they could all just do a Nick Clegg on us.