Author Topic: ESA Support Group Criteria  (Read 38348 times)

devine63

  • Charter Member and Volunteer
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4316
Re: ESA Support Group Criteria
« Reply #15 on: January 07, 2013, 10:59:12 PM »
ATurtle,

if the HCP got his facts wrong in his report about you, then that should be grounds for appeal in any case.   I cannot see how it would not be.
regards, Deb 
regards, Deb

[devine63]

KizzyKazaer

  • Global Moderator
  • Super Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7985
Re: ESA Support Group Criteria
« Reply #16 on: January 08, 2013, 09:04:05 AM »
I've had a request to make this a 'sticky';  we do seem to refer back to this thread frequently, so I've pinned it  :-)

One Girl and her Big Dog

  • Charter Member and Volunteer
  • Gold Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 197
Re: ESA Support Group Criteria
« Reply #17 on: February 15, 2013, 12:31:47 PM »
According to B&W the first descriptor is:

1.  Mobilising unaided by another person with or without a walking stick, manual wheelchair or other aid if such aid can reasonably be used.
Cannot either
 (i)  mobilise more than 50 metres on level ground without stopping in order to avoid significant discomfort or exhaustion
or
(ii)  repeatedly mobilise 50 metres within a reasonable timescale because of significant discomfort or exhaustion.

However, the DWP/ATOS don't seem to be applying the second part.  I've just been told that I qualify for ESA (without having had a medical)  but that I will be in the WRAG.  Most of the time I cannot mobilise 50 metres, and I can never do 50 metres twice.

I think I made the mistake of putting in too much information (explaining that i can walk the 22 metres to my garden room, and back if iv'e been sitting/laying down for a while).  Of course, most of the time I can't manage that without stopping for some time.

Also the B&W site says
8. Absence or loss of control over extensive evacuation of the bowel and/or bladder, other than enuresis (bed-wetting) despite the presence of any aids or adaptations normally used.
 (a) At least once a week experiences
(i) loss of control leading to extensive evacuation of the bowel and/or voiding of the bladder; or
(ii) substantial leakage of the contents of a collecting device;
sufficient to require cleaning and a change in clothing.

which isn't the same as 'full evacuation of the bladder'.  Do you know which criteria the DWP/ATOS are using.  1G

Monic1511

  • Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2012
Re: ESA Support Group Criteria
« Reply #18 on: February 15, 2013, 05:23:35 PM »
Hi 1G
both the descriptors you listed are the first part of the ESA criteria,   the support group criteria is slightly different but I haven't checked recently if they have been updated since I first put them up -  It'll be added to my "to do" list  >erm<

Monic

ChrisPage

  • Charter Member
  • Gold Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 109
Re: ESA Support Group Criteria
« Reply #19 on: April 12, 2013, 10:43:25 AM »
This just proves how corrupt the WCA is.

"Health care professionals"? Don't make me laugh....

lostfamily

  • Gold Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 136
Re: ESA Support Group Criteria
« Reply #20 on: May 10, 2013, 10:30:32 AM »
Just got back from my husband's interview with an advisor at the job centre
What was said was DH is in WRAG & will be paid until April next year as it is a contribution based benefit.
They also said they don't expect DH to look for work & accept he can't work, so asked why then is he in the WRAG & not the support group he couldn't answer that, he did say that they do have his appeal, went on to say from next July he be of an age to apply for pension credits (don't think he get it) he also said that they may call him in again in 6 month if they do if he phones they could do it on the phone, so the short of it is that they stop his money from April next year unless we win the appeal to go in the support group, if he goes in that then it not contributions based seems to me they put him in the WRAG just so they can stop paying him from next year

Torre1

  • Silver Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 36
Re: ESA Support Group Criteria
« Reply #21 on: May 10, 2013, 11:19:54 AM »
In much the same situation waiting for the appeal for support group other wise they will stop paying in Feb unable to claim income related as Oh is in receipt of a medical retirement pension which sends him over limit  as it is WRAG is reduced due to his pension  >crying<

lostfamily

  • Gold Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 136
Re: ESA Support Group Criteria
« Reply #22 on: May 10, 2013, 04:40:02 PM »
Thanks The thing we can't understand is how come that the Job Centre advisor saying they fully accept he can't work & he don't have to even look for work yet they have him in the WRAG rather than support group while he is appealing the decision to put him in the WRAG it all from his original form with the medical evidence we sent with it was the same as we sent with original ESA50 Form
On another note he has won the fact that originally said he was going to get 101.35 for his Incapacity benefit but on ESA they was giving him 100.15 they agreed he should be paid the higher amount a week

Hurtyback

  • Charter Member
  • Super Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 5800
Re: ESA Support Group Criteria
« Reply #23 on: May 10, 2013, 04:48:00 PM »
The JobCentre advisors don't have any say in what group the claimant is put in.

lostfamily

  • Gold Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 136
Re: ESA Support Group Criteria
« Reply #24 on: May 10, 2013, 04:58:53 PM »
Oh i know that but the advisor said that they have said they agree he can't work & don't have to look for work & that was nearly as soon as we got there without asking very much

KizzyKazaer

  • Global Moderator
  • Super Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7985
Re: ESA Support Group Criteria
« Reply #25 on: May 10, 2013, 06:02:11 PM »
Lostfamily - not only is Hurtyback spot on, but it's also worth noting that being in the WRAG does not mean the claimant has to be able to work here and now, nor to apply for jobs.  If your husband was well enough to do both those things, he would have been denied ESA altogether and told to claim Jobseekers' Allowance - so it's a 'given' that he has been accepted as unable to work at this moment in time.

What is expected of someone in the WRAG is that they take part in what's called 'limited work-related activity', which is different altogether and might entail things like (with the help of the Jobcentre personal adviser):  attending the work-focused interviews (WFI) in the first place; updating a CV;  performing a better-off-in-work calculation; joining a local 'work club' where members in similar positions share ideas and support each other;  take up a training opportunity.  The basic thinking behind this is that even if the WRAG claimant isn't well enough to work now, he/she may be able to do so in the future with the right support.

A good adviser will tailor the work-related activities (WRA) to a pace and time-frame that suits the individual claimant according to the current state of their health - the fact that your husband's adviser has deferred his next WFI for another six months would indicate significant acceptance that he's not really ready even for WRA, let alone paid employment!

I think you need to concentrate on the appeal now, and what Support Group criteria you both think are appropriate to your husband's claim...

lostfamily

  • Gold Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 136
Re: ESA Support Group Criteria
« Reply #26 on: May 10, 2013, 06:12:03 PM »
Thank you for your reply, while i can see if they was asking him to do anything but basically they said to him today he don't have to do anything no further thing the advisor said under the rules they may wish to do another interview in 6 months but he could do it via phone this is not that he thinks he would change but under the present rules they say check after 6 months

We are concentrating on the appeal, but i just don't seem to get my head around that they said accept he can't work he don't have to look for work or do anything else & carry on as before yet he in the WRAG seems to me it a excuse just to be able to stop his money after a year

I mean they think he can work even be in limited capacity (which we disagree with) or he can't work full stop & the advisor said he can't work & they accepted that & he did say that they have the appeal so we will wait

Lostfamily - not only is Hurtyback spot on, but it's also worth noting that being in the WRAG does not mean the claimant has to be able to work here and now, nor to apply for jobs.  If your husband was well enough to do both those things, he would have been denied ESA altogether and told to claim Jobseekers' Allowance - so it's a 'given' that he has been accepted as unable to work at this moment in time.

What is expected of someone in the WRAG is that they take part in what's called 'limited work-related activity', which is different altogether and might entail things like (with the help of the Jobcentre personal adviser):  attending the work-focused interviews (WFI) in the first place; updating a CV;  performing a better-off-in-work calculation; joining a local 'work club' where members in similar positions share ideas and support each other;  take up a training opportunity.  The basic thinking behind this is that even if the WRAG claimant isn't well enough to work now, he/she may be able to do so in the future with the right support.

A good adviser will tailor the work-related activities (WRA) to a pace and time-frame that suits the individual claimant according to the current state of their health - the fact that your husband's adviser has deferred his next WFI for another six months would indicate significant acceptance that he's not really ready even for WRA, let alone paid employment!

I think you need to concentrate on the appeal now, and what Support Group criteria you both think are appropriate to your husband's claim...

lostfamily

  • Gold Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 136
Re: ESA Support Group Criteria
« Reply #27 on: May 31, 2013, 05:28:01 PM »
Spoke to a lady today who said that they lost husband file so they looking for it, they have the appeal's letter & further evidence it the stuff that relate to his ESA50 form & the reason & what ever they have for putting him in the WRAG
I did ask about if your in the support group it not contribution based & he would get paid even pass April next year where at present they saying it stops April 2014
She asked if he got worse & i said yes he been getting worse & the evidence we sent it originally was from years ago so she suggested we should consider asking for a review also mention the fact the JC Advisor said they agreed he can't work plus he don't have to look for work so it seems they are accepting he can't work
Would like to know what you all think as i don't full trust them
Even if we do ask we won't ask before next week as he has to see the specialist again so may get further evidence
Thanks for all your support everyone

KizzyKazaer

  • Global Moderator
  • Super Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7985
Re: ESA Support Group Criteria
« Reply #28 on: May 31, 2013, 05:48:19 PM »
Quote
I did ask about if your in the support group it not contribution based & he would get paid even pass April next year where at present they saying it stops April 2014

Even if an SG award is contribution-based, it will still not be subject to the 365-day limit - it will continue to be paid for as long as a claimant meets the Support Group criteria (the longest award we're aware of to date is for 3 years before next assessment).

If you can obtain more up-to-date evidence showing that your husband's condition has indeed deteriorated, it would certainly be worth putting in for a 'change of circumstances' sooner rather than later, as the appeal could well take a few months (the change of circs decision would be made separately from this).

lostfamily

  • Gold Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 136
Re: ESA Support Group Criteria
« Reply #29 on: May 31, 2013, 06:13:23 PM »
Thank you KizzyKazaer, he been told that he contribution base ESA finishes April next year he just 61 so will officially retire in another 4 years if we can get it so he still gets paid until then without it being means tested as he gets a small pension because he was retired on ill health but he gets more than if he had to claim
So if he can get in to the support group, we said even if he don't & they stop his money there is no way he can work so what ever they decide, we have started to get more up to date evidence plus we have already sent in a letter from his doctor saying he can't work plus X-ray the lady said the appeal would still be going ahead even if he asks for a review & she said to make sure we say a Review
Thanks Again