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I understand why folk want them recorded, it’s supposed to be a fail safe, what I wonder is how the recording would be used. DM don’t watch recordings unless they’re in the fraud unit. They have extensive caseloads and are pressured to make a decision. Next stage at mr will the second dm watch it and read the comments “x walked 35m to interview room without stopping “. And reply with walked with no apparent difficulty, would be reasonable to asssume can walk 200m”.

Next stage is appeal panels, I’ve had people bring X-rays , mobile phone footage of their child’s behaviour and panels refuse to consider it as the X-ray can’t be copied and the footage could be of anyone filmed at any time.

How do you assess hidden disabilities like E, diabetes etc and as you mentioned how will the assessor in Cardiff understand the responses given by a Geordie or Glaswegian .

I still believe the criteria is the first part of the problem, yes assessments are flawed, I read plenty of them and we have a list of repeat offenders which our boss feeds back. If your assessment is inaccurate then complain. By now complaining you give it the veneer of credibility.   One appeal judge starts his appeal with “ is the assessment report a true and accurate record yes or no” if you say no his next comment is have you complained? Eh, no, then he assumes that it must be true else you’d have complained.  I know that’s wrong but that’s the angle he takes after all you have put the effort into taking your case to appeal.
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Disability Talk / Re: First I've heard of this- Are PIP assessments going to be videoed ?
« Last post by JLR2 on September 18, 2018, 09:59:46 PM »
Monic, recording assessments really ought never to have been something that folk found themselves calling for and I feel only came about through the chalk and cheese differences in the assessments experienced by claimants and the report put to decision makers. This might come over as a bit daft but I was thinking had the DM's to been given assessments which truly reflected the original assessments they would have been in a far better position to come to fair decisions and many people would not have faced the nightmare they have.

It is all too easy for me to talk of recorded assessments as some sort of cure for bad/poor assessment reporting but as I'm typing away it crosses my mind that although I can hear clearly my thoughts how my accent or spoken word may sound in a recording could lead to some folk trying to work out what I'm saying might not be so easy. I have experienced problems trying to understand my own sister at times when we have been talking on the phone.

A while back I was invited to chat on BBC Radio Scotland's phone in and as is my habit I recorded my tuppence-worth, well when I played it back after the call I sounded terrible, certainly nowhere near as clear as it did in my own head during the phone call. So how things might sound in a WCA recording could likewise not be quite as clear as I'd like to think it was.
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JLR2 I think it must be me who has caused the despair as I haven’t been overwhelmingly upbeat about recording assessments but my view point is that of a representative at appeals.
Maybe I’ll get an explanation and then I can explain my comments.  >dove<
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Cafe / Re: Re-launching the ship happyness by bulekingfisher
« Last post by bulekingfisher on September 18, 2018, 05:32:50 PM »
Hello SashaQ


OOOer missus I've just come a cropper I hit a half exposed tree root with my right hand stabilizer + tipped in to a very cold muddy pool so I'm going back to the ship to get a hot shower + changed in to all dry cloth's. So see you back home SashaQ + we can have a game of domino's + a few other crew can join in to make it more interesting.
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Disability Talk / Re: First I've heard of this- Are PIP assessments going to be videoed ?
« Last post by JLR2 on September 17, 2018, 08:52:40 PM »
''I have to admit to despairing at some of the comments on this thread''

I'm not sure quite what comments have caused your despair Lankou, for myself I have only concerns that any videos recorded be duplicated at time of recording with one copy being given to the claimant involved. I think in the main when the Police have recorded interviews with someone the recorded person has a copy made available for their solicitor/lawyer.

All WCA assessments should be at the very least audio recorded and in being so recorded allow a comparison to be made with an assessor's written report/assessment.

I remember two issues with previous assessments I have gone through which I feel could be quite relevant in regards to videoing of assessments. The first happened in the early 1990's, the assessor's report made a comment in relation to my appearance, ''The claimant appeared rather unkempt in his appearance''  I was not applying for the position as his daughter's next boyfriend this remark was uncalled for and the tribunal to which I made my appeal to agreed, the second issue relates to the comment by the GP assessor whom carried out my last assessment for ESA, as I entered the assessment room he remarked to me, ''You look like someone I could trust''.

I've mentioned these two experiences to highlight just how someone's appearance can have an impact on the outcome of their assessment and feel that beyond simply what a claimant says in answer to an assessor's questions or the evidence that the claimant being assessed has provided their appearance will, in the case of videoed assessments, have an impact on their assessment decisions. There could be cases where the claimant is a heavily tattooed person or perhaps say a woman who has borrowed a nicer outfit than she herself owns, maybe from her sister, because she feels she needs to look as tidy as she can only to find that the personal view of the assessor is allowed, even subconsciously, to influence their assessment of the claimant. My last assessor even noted and reported that I could handle a pen as I took notes, (his name and so on)  so there is more to videoing assessments than might cross someone's mind at first thought. There are things like were a claimant wears tie up shoes, 'can tie shoes'  or were I to wear my dress shoes polished to parade ground standards would be very much noticed and noted by an assessor.

Talking of how claimants dress for their assessments brought to my mind another issue where videoing is involved, in the course of many assessments claimants may be asked to remove items of clothing, I was asked to display the damage to my right ankle and the scarring from the operation relating to my knee cap dislocation, how might a woman feel about the security of videoed recordings where she may have been required to remove clothing to particular points of undress?

I think until they (the DWP) have organised the audio recording for all WCA assessments the videoing should be limited.
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Disability Talk / Re: First I've heard of this- Are PIP assessments going to be videoed ?
« Last post by lankou on September 17, 2018, 03:30:23 PM »
I have to admit to despairing at some of the comments on this thread. It has taken years of campaigning by many people, me, and organisations to get the DWP to acknowledge that a claimant has a right under the law to have benefit related medicals/assessments sound recorded and videod. That is a right, it will not be comulsory.
It reasons for the campaign were to stop claimaints being "verballed," and whoever does the medicals/assessments from lying in the report to the DWP.

Benefits and Work have just posted this. (live links at link.)

https://www.benefitsandwork.co.uk/news/3802-no-progress-on-pip-video-recording-or-claim-form-improvements

No progress on PIP video recording or claim form improvements
Category: Latest news
 Created: 17 September 2018
The House of Commons Work and Pensions Committee has slammed the government for failing to make any progress on video recording PIP assessments or improving PIP and ESA claim forms, arguing that the DWP “still refuses to engage with the huge problems” connected with claiming the benefits.

Back in June of this year we highlighted a statement by Sarah Newton, Minister of State for Disabled People, who claimed that the DWP were about to pilot the videoing of PIP assessments. The intention was to make “. . . video recording of the PIP assessment a standard part of the process . . . We will be piloting videoing the assessment with a view to then rolling this out across Great Britain.”

Though this decision appeared to have been made without any form of consultation with claimants and, judging from the comments we have received, many would prefer audio recordings only.

The government gave assurances that they would carry out this work following a highly critical report on PIP and ESA by the Commons committee, which was based in part on an unprecedented number of responses from claimants to a call for evidence.

However, three months on and there is no sign of the pilot even having begun.

Nor is there any evidence of work being done on make the claim forms for PIP or ESA any more user-friendly, another undertaking given by the minister.

Whilst welcoming the latest response from the government, which they have published on their website, the Work and Pensions Committee is now asking for a detailed progress report on these issues.

Frank Field MP, Chair of the Committee, said:

"There is a welcome change of tone in this response which seems to finally begin to acknowledge the deep distress and difficulty PIP& ESA claimants have experienced.

“But that counts for little when it still refuses to engage with the huge problems in quality control—the reports riddled with errors and omissions, the huge numbers of overturned decisions, the outsourced contractors that rarely or never hit their targets—and when the pace of the change it is making is painfully slow.

“Claiming a benefit to which you are legitimately entitled should never be a humiliating, distressing experience. Government must move now, faster, to make this right."

You can read more on the parliament website.



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Disability Talk / Re: First I've heard of this- Are PIP assessments going to be videoed ?
« Last post by JLR2 on September 16, 2018, 09:32:26 PM »
Thanks Monic for letting me know of this as it is something that had not crossed my mind. As best I can remember I ticked the no boxes on my forms when it came to getting around in unfamiliar places or journeys.

Don't know what it is but I find myself feeling low tonight. I keep looking around my house trying to think of how/where to start tidying up the place. Every flat surface has clutter on it and all I seem able to do is move the clutter from one place to another. It's a nice enough wee house but the lack of storage cupboards has me looking to see where next I bang some nails in the walls to put up more shelves. I'd really like to create more floor space, you know see what the colour of my carpet is >biggrin<

Given the amounts of A4 paper I have, letters from the DWP, NHS and various others I need a filing cabinet (floor to ceiling)  Apart from the paper work I've masses of electrical wiring, chargers from old devices and USB cables all thrown into wee boxes and under the bed or in drawers and of course I experience the same problem as everyone else, that of never being able to find these cables when I go looking for one.

Maybe I'll think of something tomorrow.
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The problem with a claimant going holiday is (wrongly in my opinion) that dwp portray that person as able to cope with changes, able to mobilise and able to deal with people.  If you have any points for mobility or social skills don’t mention holidays.  One person had delusions that they were on pilgrimage to 4 European countries and had convinced the gp they were going, none of it was true but the panel refused to give additional points for going unfamiliar places as they believe the claimant had been all over Europe.

Information is great but be careful how it’s presented
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Disability Talk / Re: First I've heard of this- Are PIP assessments going to be videoed ?
« Last post by JLR2 on September 16, 2018, 09:28:32 AM »
I suppose I'm just that little bit wary about things. As Monic was saying, ''fine if you have a good relationship with your GP''  it would only take my GP to, on being asked to carry out a wca assessment on me, to think of how I have over recent years been visiting Berlin 3 times a year for 4 weeks when he is knocking his pan in at his surgery and only managing the regular holiday breaks most folk in work manage.

In a roundabout way my friend's father passing away will help me reduce my visits to Berlin as my friend will be able to visit Scotland. Mind you having said that the way I'm hearing things in the news about UK/European flights, travel between the UK/Europe and passport validity following Brexit things might get a bit complicated visitor visas and the like.
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I dont see why your GP would be annoyed about you going to Berlin. It is more likely that it is just a personal detail he knows about you and comes to at the end of the appointment.

 :-)
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