Ouch Too - a place for and about disabled people.

Forum => Talk => Topic started by: SashaQ on 05 Jun 2019 07:07PM

Title: Fascinating Fact Check
Post by: SashaQ on 05 Jun 2019 07:07PM

"government spending on disability benefits rose by 5.9 billion in real terms between 2007 and 2017."

"when it comes to disability-related cash payments, like tax credits and Personal Independence Payments, the UK languishes near the bottom of the table"

Links in with this: https://www.theguardian.com/society/2019/jan/15/disability-benefits-reform-costs-government-4bn-in-extra-welfare-payments "The OBR said the growing number of appeals was one of several causes of the unexpected rise in costs."
Title: Re: Fascinating Fact Check
Post by: huhn on 06 Jun 2019 08:03AM
maybe the payments to the people who  deal with the paperwork increased or the number of people working on the paperwork increased or the salary of the minister... increased.
Title: Re: Fascinating Fact Check
Post by: Frances on 06 Jun 2019 10:27AM
Sounds about right !! >lol<
Title: Re: Fascinating Fact Check
Post by: Sunny Clouds on 08 Jun 2019 12:38PM
Recent governments have had no honesty about how they present the statistics.

I'm trying to remember who it was that was caught out by an MP for misleading parliament a while back by quoting a figure for benefits paid to disabled people that included benefits that were paid to people who just happened to be disabled but not because they were disabled, e.g. ESA for people who happened to be disabled.

There's also a factor in all this that a lot of politicians of all parties seem to miss when changing things to save money, and many media outlets would rather not mention.  It's to do with awareness raising.

Analogy - the Mail Online is one of the most widely read English language news sites in the world.  They go on and on and on about how supposedly immigrants to this country get in really easily even if they're not supposed to, get loads of benefits (supposedly more than people already here) including free houses, and then take the jobs that the people here supposedly won't do, even though they're easy and well-paid.

Well, if you lived somewhere you wanted to get away from, whether because of war or extreme poverty or whatever, and someone in your village or town, or even just visiting it, had access to the internet, mightn't a little research show that the UK was a good place to head for?

You won't catch the Mail (or similar outlets) mentioning modern slavery, exploitation, hunger/foodbanks, racial prejudice, religious prejudice etc.

Likewise benefits.

Cut funding to local authorities, NHS, supported housing etc, thereby cutting day centres,  support at all levels from personal care to advice, disability equipment, rapid & appropriate healthcare to prevent unnecessary deterioration and/or dependency etc., etc.

Then keep telling them there are benefits out there they may be able to get to that lots of people get and, according to the Mail etc. are dead easy to get even if you're not really entitled, and lots of people who are entitled will claim them.  Telling them people who aren't entitled are getting them might encourage a few who are trying it on to apply, but the claims that will really swell the numbers are those that should have been getting DLA and weren't claiming because they didn't know about it or didn't feel up to applying.  Telling them PIP is replacing it won't stop the increase in claims by new genuine claimants.

I was never told about DLA by anyone official.  Nobody involved in my healthcare told me (which includes social workers).  I was told by someone who'd previously been my client when I was a lawyer.

The irony is that if I'd had proper financial advice at the right time, I could have made some really good financial moves, including claiming on some insurance I'd got and claiming an early enhanced pension from my employers on the basis of being unlikely to return to work, probably enhanced with the right 'threat' of being sued for constructive dismissal etc.  I'd probably never have even thought of claiming DLA.

People in power refuse to acknowledge that people act on the information available to them.  Well, they know it when it comes to carefully orchestrated election/referendum campaigns, but not when it comes to everyday behaviour.

And you'll never see statistics like:-

A. Figures for now, 5 years ago, 10 years ago for:-
[national]Benefits paid to disabled people...
Out of which ... paid actually because they were disabled
Out of which ... paid because we'd cut other support

B. Figures for now, 5 years ago, 10 years ago for:-
Financial support for disabled people (paid because they were disabled) out of public funds other than benefits ...
Plus value of non-financial support for disabled people (provided because they were disabled)...

Net cut to support for disabled people broken down by type of support.

(And as I type this, I'm thinking of Huhn and betting there are also similar issues where she is and in other countries in terms of politicians being disingenuous about cuts.)
Title: Re: Fascinating Fact Check
Post by: huhn on 08 Jun 2019 07:47PM
many years ago i studied for my MBA with the open university and had  as one subject professional judgement taken, i think this one must be given in school that everyone can read statistics , especially the ones from the government.
Title: Re: Fascinating Fact Check
Post by: Monic1511 on 09 Jun 2019 04:08PM
In my area the amount of people claiming PIP DLA AA is up because the council has a welfare rights team, money advisors were merged with the welfare rights officers and between them the residents can increase their income and negotiate manageable repayments of debts.

Statistics wise a boss had to explain to the councillors that the service cost the same as a loaf of bread (about 90p) per month but increased the council income by over 1.5million.  This was because the more people on PIP/DLA/AA the higher their entitlement to housing benefit and council tax reduction.  both these benefits get paid to the council and the more residents in receipt of these benefit the more funding the council could get from central government.

Title: Re: Fascinating Fact Check
Post by: KizzyKazaer on 09 Jun 2019 05:25PM
...both these benefits get paid to the council and the more residents in receipt of these benefit the more funding the council could get from central government.

That's something I didn't know, so it's a fascinating fact check in more ways than one...